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Flapjack
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Here is something interesting I just read. This is from an F-150 forum, which ironically, my 3v 5.4L came from:

If the Bank #1 cam was out of time it would NOT set a P0340 or a P0345 code. You would get a P1381. The P0340 and P0345 is what the PCM sets when it doesn't get ANY signal from the CMP (Cam Position) sensors!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake dog:
When this truck is running it doesn't make a difference on how it runs when the cmp on bank 1 is plugged in or not .

That's because the PCM only uses the CMP sensor at engine start up. The CKP sensor is used to figure out where in its rotation a particulr piston is, for example, #1 is at TDC. But that isn't enough for the PCM to figure out if it should fire the injector for #1 or the coil for #1 because even though #1 is at TDC, it needs to know if the piston is on its compression stroke OR its exhaust stroke. That's what it uses the CMP sensor for.

If it doesn't have a CMP sensor to work with at start up, some versions will try and fire a few injectors at random while the engine is cranking to see if it can get lucky. If the engine starts, the PCM can figure out where #1 is and what stroke it is on and just keeps track of it from there on out. No need for the CMP sensor.

Just to recap: The P0340/P0345 says the PCM didn't get a CMP sensor signal. If Bank #1's cam is out of time it will set a P1381.

BTW, the PCM compares the CMP sensor signal and the CKP (Crank Position) sensor to determine if the cam is out of time. But if you get a P0340 code (no CMP sensor signal) there is no way you can get a P1381 (bank #1 cam out of time) because it needs BOTH a CKP a CMP signal to deterine if it is out of time!
http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/97...l#post11449269


2005 Legend Lime 5.4L 3v
14psi: 802 rwhp/789 rwtq , 21psi: 1018 rwhp/988 rwtq
TurboHP TT Kit MMR engine, RGR heads/cams
Corn fed on E85!
Built by me, tuned by Lito! (dyno video)
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Flapjack
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07-01-2015

After my post last night, I did a little more troubleshooting. I first unplugged the oil pan sensor, as some have said that helped with the P0345 error (on an F150). Not sure why it would. I also tried running the car with no CMP or MAF sensors plugged in. Same errors. I also pulled apart the fuse box to check for bent pins, and removed the fender well cover to get at the PCM behind the fender. All plugs were good there, and nicely seated. After I was done with all that, I did another compression check (150psi on each side).

The car sounds great when it's idling. The wrench light, and subsequent P0340/P0345 after restarting the car, don't come up unless I bring the engine RPM up past 3000 for more than a second or two. If I let it idle, I can datalog and everything looks perfect. AFR on both banks is a steady 14.6-14.7, short-term fuel trims are within 1-2% on each side, though most of the time they are at 0-1% (that wouldn't be the case if the timing was off). Spark and load is exactly where it should be, and ECT settles in at 192F after warming up.

I honestly don't know what else to check.


2005 Legend Lime 5.4L 3v
14psi: 802 rwhp/789 rwtq , 21psi: 1018 rwhp/988 rwtq
TurboHP TT Kit MMR engine, RGR heads/cams
Corn fed on E85!
Built by me, tuned by Lito! (dyno video)
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Flapjack
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07-04-2015

I finally found the problem. One of the wires (the 12v, I believe) was broken inside. Ironically, it wasn't at either of the two solder points on the extension, but was closer to the connector. At least 1-2 strands were still connected, as it passed all the continuity tests I did... even all the way back to the PCM.

So now the car runs without a wrench light or CMP codes. I just need to figure out why the AFRs are sitting at 10-11 on both sides. It's pig rich right now, even when warmed all the way up.



2005 Legend Lime 5.4L 3v
14psi: 802 rwhp/789 rwtq , 21psi: 1018 rwhp/988 rwtq
TurboHP TT Kit MMR engine, RGR heads/cams
Corn fed on E85!
Built by me, tuned by Lito! (dyno video)
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Flapjack
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Well, I'm back to the P0340 and P0345. The car was idling on its own when I ran it last. It was just very, very rich. The vacuum was low, like -5 to -7 (normally -10 with my cams), but the engine wasn't idling well, either. If I brought the RPMs up even slightly, vacuum looked normal. Still, I figured it must be a vacuum problem, especially since it was showing up on both widebands. I decided to leave it alone for a few hours, take a nap, then see if I could find something else wrong.

When I started working on it again, I started with the vacuum lines. I checked every single one by hand to see if they were disconnected, broken, pinched, cut, etc. They all seemed fine. So I went to start the car up again so that I could spray some carb cleaner around the intake, intake tubing, etc... but it wouldn't stay running. It was doing the same thing before I fixed the MAF wire, but this time, the ad counts were clearly showing up on the data logger. I also did a compression test to make sure the cams were still good, and they were.

I'm at a loss. I feel like I've gone over everything, but I'm sure I'm missing something.


2005 Legend Lime 5.4L 3v
14psi: 802 rwhp/789 rwtq , 21psi: 1018 rwhp/988 rwtq
TurboHP TT Kit MMR engine, RGR heads/cams
Corn fed on E85!
Built by me, tuned by Lito! (dyno video)
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Flapjack
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I doubt anyone is still following this, but here's an update:

So a friend helped me track down what else is wrong with the car... and this one, I can't really explain. Only that it's been a big problem in the past.

Short story, something is up with the TB motor and/or TPS.

Long story, back in 2012, after swapping a stock 5.4 for the built one from MMR, the car wouldn't start. I would get the codes P2101, P2104, and P2110, which basically listed forced limited RPM/power and throttle body motor range issues. The only time I ever touched that particular harness was back in 2008, when I did the original V6 to V8 swap. I could not get the GT500 I had to fit in the normal orientation, so I had to flip it upside-down. The TB motor and TPS harnesses needed to be extended. I soldered and shrink-wrapped like I usually do, and those connections are still good to this day.

After no kidding, a month of troubleshooting, I figured out if I reversed the wires on the TB harness, the car would start and run perfectly. I had absolutely no explanation for it. The wires were correct prior to, but reversing them did the trick... even if it drove my OCD crazy. All was fine until just yesterday.

Outside of the timing and MAF harness issues I've fixed so far, the car really behaved erratically. One day, it would start fine, and idle on its own. Other days, I couldn't keep it running without tapping the gas. Yesterday, it wouldn't run at all. I'd get one big rev when it started, but it would die immediately after.... even if I tapped the gas pedal. It had codes this time... the same as back in 2012: P2101, P2104, and P2110.

That's when we started zeroing in on the TB. We pulled the intake tubing off, and were able to verify it was not able to do its full range test at key on. We pulled it off and hooked it to a small 12v battery I have, and it did the same thing. We reversed the wires, and it opened all the way like it should. So we reinstalled it and switched the wires. Now, it cycled through its range check like it should, but the car still wouldn't run. Same codes, so we checked if the flapper moved with the gas pedal, which it didn't.

This time, I am 100% sure I didn't reverse the wires. Still, I cannot think of a single scenario where the wiring would need change... ever. But twice now, that's gotten the TB to start working again. Today, the wiring is back as it should be on a stock car... but I'm still getting codes.

I ordered a new OEM GT500 TB, which I should hopefully have in a few days. I'm really hoping this is it.


2005 Legend Lime 5.4L 3v
14psi: 802 rwhp/789 rwtq , 21psi: 1018 rwhp/988 rwtq
TurboHP TT Kit MMR engine, RGR heads/cams
Corn fed on E85!
Built by me, tuned by Lito! (dyno video)
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JimC
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I keep following your issues - and sorry but no ideas to offer you.

I know how frustrating tracking the problem can be though (hopefully with my new waste gate I solve the overboosting and engine breaking problem on my car!). My car sat for a year after the first engine was blown.


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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimC View Post
I keep following your issues - and sorry but no ideas to offer you.

I know how frustrating tracking the problem can be though (hopefully with my new waste gate I solve the overboosting and engine breaking problem on my car!). My car sat for a year after the first engine was blown.
Ugg, that sucks. What kind of wastegate was it? I've never really known of any that's happened to... though I know it does happen.

My car sat for at least a year... maybe 1.5 years. I just didn't have the heart or energy for it. Had a lot going on in my life... school, family, work... mostly good, so it was easy to put it off for a while. After a while, I really started to miss the car, so I called Mark at MMR and got the engine out. So it's a little frustrating that things are not working. Guess the car didn't like sitting for that long, lol.


2005 Legend Lime 5.4L 3v
14psi: 802 rwhp/789 rwtq , 21psi: 1018 rwhp/988 rwtq
TurboHP TT Kit MMR engine, RGR heads/cams
Corn fed on E85!
Built by me, tuned by Lito! (dyno video)
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JimC
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It is a Turbosmart gate, and the new one arrived today. I was able to move the valve on this one so we'll see if it takes care of the problem.


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Flapjack
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimC View Post
It is a Turbosmart gate, and the new one arrived today. I was able to move the valve on this one so we'll see if it takes care of the problem.
Any reason why you didn't go with the typical Tial one?

I can't find a (re)build thread. What engine are you running now?

Good luck. I hope it fixes it.


2005 Legend Lime 5.4L 3v
14psi: 802 rwhp/789 rwtq , 21psi: 1018 rwhp/988 rwtq
TurboHP TT Kit MMR engine, RGR heads/cams
Corn fed on E85!
Built by me, tuned by Lito! (dyno video)
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JimC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flapjack View Post
Any reason why you didn't go with the typical Tial one?

I can't find a (re)build thread. What engine are you running now?

Good luck. I hope it fixes it.
Because that is what Hellion puts in the kit. I still have the stock 3.7L V6 in the car, picked up a low mileage (5,000) engine out of a wrecked 2014.


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